THE TRINITY DEBATE COMES TO KIWI RIVERMAN...
This is an old post which I have not posted here before:
The following has proven very popular at other blogsites and might interest you.
Please read on:
"Should we believe in the Trinity - the Trinity debate?"
Do you personally believe in the Trinity? I was actually brought up to believe in it from my earliest days at Sunday School, so many decades ago, when most of my generation attended regularly every Sunday morning.
It appears to me that it has always been a central doctrine of the church.I believe that it has always been there, just like the Cross. Should it be a subject that is more than just a passing interest? So I looked for some information from an organisation that obviously knows a little bit about the subject.The following is from The Watchtower magazine, with thanks!
Various Trinitarian concepts exist. But generally the Trinity teaching is that in the Godhead there are three persons, Father,Son and Holy Ghost; yet together they are but one God. The doctrine says that the three are co-equal, almighty, and uncreated, having existed in the Godhead.
Others, however, say that the Trinity doctrine is false, that Almighty God stands alone as a separate, eternal, and all-powerful being. They say that Jesus in his pre-human existence was, like the angels, a separate spirit person created by God, and for this reason he must have had a beginning.They teach that Jesus has never been Almighty God's equal in any sense; he has always been subject to God and still is.They also believe that the Holy Ghost is not a person but God's spirit, his active force.
Supporters of the Trinity say that it is founded not on religious tradition but also on the Bible.Critics of the doctrine say that it is not a Bible teaching, one history source even declaring:" The origin of the Trinity is entirely pagan." - THE PAGAN IN OUR CHRISTIANITY.
If the Trinity is true, it is degrading to Jesus to say he was never equal to God as part of the Godhead. But if the Trinity is false, it is degrading to Almighty God to call anyone his equal, and even worse to call Mary the " Mother of God". If the Trinity is false, it dishonors God to say as noted in the book of Catholicism: "Unless people keep their faith whole and undefiled without doubt they shall perish forever- lastingly.And the Catholic Faith is this: we worship one God in Trinity."
How is the Trinity explained?
The Roman Catholic Church states: The Father is God,the Son is God, and the Holy Spirit is God, and yet there are not three Gods but one God, In this Trinity...the Persons are co-eternal and co-equal: all alike are uncreated and omnipotent - the Catholic Encyclopedia. Nearly all other churches in Christendom also agree.
But wait a minute there, Jesus is the Son of God, not God the Father. How can he be the Father of Himself?
Furthermore,Islam believes that Jesus was but one of the great Prophets, not the Son of God, just to throw another spanner in the works!
What do you believe?
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6 comments:
Hutt, man you are getting close to my heart. If you think God is one you have got it. Try out the analogy of water, but in three forms: as a vapor, a liquid, as a solid (ice). All the same thing.
All these are manifestations of God: The Father in Creation, the Son in Redemption, The Holy Ghost in Sanctification. I think as long as you don't see them as a committee you do well.
I have also seen this issue argued to the point of hurting innocent people. Know that explaining the Godhead has NEVER been completely accomplished.
Interesting, Charles. This subject creates its own debate. But Jesus claimed he was the son of God, and spoke of his Father. Just leaves the Holy Spirit?
Cheers
You did a great job of explaining how confusing the issue is. It doesn't really make sense, but the fact that the trinity concept is in more than just the Christian faith says something - what, im not sure. Maybe this is something we could clearly grasp if we thought in the 4th dimension. But we only have a glimpse of its importance as far as our minds can see.
I'm inclined to believe you. Extremely complex issue this.
Thanks for your imput.
I am with Bstone on that fourth dimension thing. It is about time and space. God is in all time and all space. New Testament teases with talking about Jesus, since before the foundation of the world and that nothing was made that wasn't made by him. Jesus,He talks about God in Him and Him in us. And the Holy Spirit in us so we would not be alone and Jesus could always be with us, so we would not be comfortless (didn't He say "I will come unto you"(?) . The God everywhere has to manifest to us in our limitations, in time and space it is Jesus, It is the Holy Spirit.
The Holy Spirit is what is in us -- so we are Godly too?
God the Father, the Son and we Holy humans?
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